Comments on: Obama struggles to equate Israel with ‘Palestine’

By: Vic Rosenthal

Vic Rosenthal — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 22:52:35 +0000

Ittay, it is far worse than what Obama is calling for: total withdrawal to pre-67 lines, no recognition of the Jewish state, and a right of return — to Israel. Look at this http://fresnozionism.org/archives/1239 for a discussion of recognition, and this http://fresnozionism.org/archives/1240 for what I think about the principle of right of return, even if not realized.
Abbas has insisted on “not one centimeter less” than the pre-67 territory; consider that Jews lived in East Jerusalem (etc.) prior to 1948 when they were shot and kicked out by the Jordanians who invaded and occupied the region. Now the Arabs refuse to compromise on ’settlements’ that are actually neighborhoods?
I think that Qureia, Abbas, Erekat etc. are not serious about peace or they would have moved a bit in their positions since 1967!
Finally, how can you say it’s worth taking the risk of withdrawing from the West Bank when Hamas is likely to take over? How did withdrawal from Gaza work out?

By: ittay

ittay — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 22:17:27 +0000

You claim that Israel will never be able to help the Palestinians achieve their national aspirations because they “aspire to rule from the river to the sea” and “Jewish state of any size in this area is unacceptable to them.” This is simply not the case. It reminds me of Palestinian propagandists who say the Likud believes that Israel’s borders should include shtei gadot (both sides of the Jordan).

If you would like to understand things clearer, please read this article from last week’s Haaretz, where the Chief Palestinian Negotiator explains exactly what would be required for the Palestinians to fulfil their national aspirations.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1088237.html

It’s very similar to what Obama was calling for. It would require Israel making very painful concessions, in the hope that the Palestinians would respond by calling for an end to all attacks on Israel. Agreeing to the Palestinians demands would be a big risk. However, I believe maintaining the status quo indefinitely, is even riskier.

By: Vic Rosenthal

Vic Rosenthal — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 15:15:53 +0000

Yes, the Keffiyah picture isn’t helpful. Recently I saw a video of Nadia Matar talking about him. Her approach, pronouncing his name Barack HUSSEIN Obama in a sneering tone was also not helpful.
However I am not too hopeful about his approach. There is definitely a change in policy since the last administration (which was not so great itself after 2006), and the change is not in the pro-Israel direction.

By: Shalom Freedman

Shalom Freedman — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 14:28:39 +0000

I don’t disagree with the analysis presented here. There is false symmetry and an incorrect reading of History in Obama’s analysis of the Palestinian Arab story.
But in considering Obama’s speech as a whole I think it is necessary to commend him on a number of very significant points. He did speak about the ‘unbreakable bond’ between the United States and Israel. This in effect was his way of discouraging those who believe that the path to Israel’s destruction is by first disconnecting it from the U.S. He did call for the Islamic world as a whole to recognize and live in peace with Israel. He did speak out against the evil of Holocaust- denial and indicate that it is a moral blight on the Islamic world itself. He did also present ideas about democracy, freedom , woman’s rights which were a kind of moral message to the Islamic world.
I write this in part because I am troubled at the thought that a ‘demonizing’ of the President on the part of pro-Israel people is exactly what our enemies want. I believe we must have a balanced, reason, accurate approach. In this sense I very much appreciate the rational and correct criticisms of Obama’s speech made by Vic Rosenthal, Charles Krauthammer, P.David Hornik, Barry Rubin, among others. But I object strongly to those kinds of criticisms which put him in a keffiyah call him Arafat, make him the enemy of Israel and the Jewish people. Such criticisms are wrong and potentially disastrous for us.